Rheumatoid Arthritis

Tapering off drugs and doing Bikram Yoga with Katy

Katy is back for her 2 year update! She has done phenomenally well in the past two years, building even further on the progress she made in her first year on the Paddison Program. [See her first episode here]. We discuss how:

  • Katie was diagnosed with juvenile idiopathic arthritis when she was just 10 months old
  • She was put on antibiotics after a series of ear infections and a month after she had her first RA symptoms
  • She was put on baby aspirin, prednisone and pancreole with high dosage until she was five
  • She was then put on methotrexate and starting at 10 she switched to Enbrel
  • When she started her first job her doctor put her on Vicodin to manage the pain, but dosage went up and side effects started to appear
  • Katy went into a depressive state but soon after she found Clint’s TEDx Talk and the Paddison Program
  • Along with the diet change, Bikram Yoga helped immensely
  • She has tapered off Vicodin and her pain levels have dropped
  • Katy represented Oregan in a yoga competition and overcame many self confidence fears to do so
  • Katy has spoken internationally about her story on the Isle of Man
  • Katy’s diet has expanded in the past two years and she loves her food that keeps her healthy

Listen To This Episode Here

Clint Well
today we’ve got one of our fabulous guests back on the show for a two
year update almost to the day. And I think it’s really important to
get some of our guests back on the show.

Clint Maybe a
year or two later so that we can show that not only have people been
able to continue to thrive with their Paddison Program but also in
many cases improve even further because you see a lot of testimonials
online for meat inclusive diets and these other approaches and it can
be enticing to think well maybe there’s another way. But what we
don’t see from these kind of online testimonials from other
approaches that include food products that we know from a science
point of view don’t help us is that these results can be fleeting.
And so it’s really important to get guests back on our show and say
Hey here’s someone a year or even two years later and they’re
thriving, they’re doing great so that these results aren’t fleeting
These are lifestyle choices that can help keep us well for very long
periods of time.

Clint So
today we’ve got Katie back on the show. Welcome Katie.

Katy Hi

Clint It’s a
great thrill to have you back and you and I haven’t spoken face to
face since last time we did our first recording but of course we’ve
been in constant contact I would say most days inside Paddison
Program support where you’re not only you know post your own updates
but you support other people and share your inspirational progress.
And so today I just wanted to to recap where you’re at a couple of
years ago and then we’ll move forward and talk about all the things
that you’ve done since then because there’s certainly a long list of
of activities and accolades that you have in your cap since two years
ago. So it’s pretty exciting so first if anyone hasn’t watched the
first episode with Katie go back and check that out at your leisure.
It’s a fabulous conversation that we had and very moving because
Katie you were diagnosed with juvenile idiopathic arthritis when you
were as young as 12 months old or even 10 months old so why don’t
just for the people who are just seeing you for the first time here,
can you just go through your story really quickly in a bullet point
format. Before we go any further because it is I mean the next few
minutes as you go through this people are going to be like You’re
kidding me. You really went through all that. So let’s let’s hear
that summary of kind of what you went through and where you were at
last time we spoke.

Katy Yeah. So
throughout this journey this healing journey I’ve really been
learning a lot more about myself and a lot more about how I actually
got the arthritis. There’s been a lot of you know a lot of ifs and
buts and stuff. So I’ve got a lot of good facts from my mom who’s
written down a lot of notes and stuff. And so my story of course
starts off really young. So I was born healthy. And then at two
months old I had my first ear infection and they put me on
antibiotics for the ear infection and then a couple months after that
I had another ear infection and they put me on more antibiotics. And
then a month after that I had another ear infection and they put me
on more antibiotics and then a month after that I got my first RA
symptom of a swollen ankle. And that was at 10 months old.

Katy And then
I had another ear infection and they gave me more antibiotics and
then a week after that I got my first my swollen left elbow would
later became dislocated. And then I got a viral infection like a
month after that. And so I was like I had a fever and like blisters
in my mouth and all this stuff. And so they put me on more
antibiotics again and then so January 1992 was when I was officially
diagnosed with JRA. So it’s month before my birthday.

Katy And so
they put me on a bunch of baby aspirin and prednisone and pancreole.
And then they ended up overdosing me a little bit on the baby aspirin
because I was just in so much pain. They just kept upping the dose to
the point where it ruptured my eardrum and I got a bloody ear drum
and in other ears you hear stuff and so yes.

Katy So
basically I was on those drugs until I was five. I couldn’t walk on
my own until I was about four years old. So on five years old they
put me on methotrexate. They took me off all the prednisone and all
that. And then. And then at 10 years old they switched back to
Enbrel. And we’re sure biologic. And so for the first two years I was
tapering off of the methotrexate so I was actually taking both the
methotrexate and the Enbrel together so I was injecting myself about
three times a week in my legs either leg and I was doing that and I
was homeschooled. Most of my life I’ve had 12 surgeries most of them
are eye surgeries.

Katy I have
glaucoma, uveitis, which is a side effect of the rheumatoid arthritis
and just grew up with a lot of stiffness, a lot of pain a lot of
loneliness, just a lot of confusion. You know that the whole deal.
And then so then what really started to me going downhill was when I
first started my first job in 2010 because of course I wasn’t used to
being on my feet for long periods of time. So it just got to the
point where in 2012 my doctor put me on bicodin because the pain just
got… the pain was just way I couldn’t manage life without it. And
so at the time it was very helpful and I started it out with just
like two pills a day. And but of course your body gets used to it.
And so I had to up it and up and up. So by 2016,I was taking roughly
between four and eight Bicodins a day for the pain.

Katy So yeah
and it got to the point where you know my constipation was really
bad. I was getting depression I was getting a suicide whatever stuff
that I didn’t even realize. I didn’t really realize what it was doing
to me at the time because it just kind of sneaks up on you. And then,
so the end of 2016 is when I just was kind of like OK this is like I
have to figure something out like I can’t live the rest of my life
like this.

Katy And so
then I found you and watched your TED talk and then I was like OK
this guy’s legit. He has arthritis like you know this is the real
thing. So I remember the night before I had a big case of red velvet
cake and I was like This is probably going to be my last time I’m
going to eat this. And it’s true it is the last time. But oh man.
Yeah. It’s been a life changer. And that’s kind of where we left off.

Katy The last

Clint Yes I
think. I think you’d made some. I think we are 12 months in. After
you’d started the program when we spoke I think you’d made some
tremendous improvements by changing your diet and also going to
Bikram yoga. I think you’ve been able to reduce some of the Vicodin.
I think your joint symptom. Yeah. And I think your joint symptoms
were tremendously better than what they had been previously with your
range of motion and stuff is all that correct?

Katy Yes.

Clint Yes.
Okay. So. And I think that we’re probably not doing justice to some
of other improvements and that’s all there in the other podcast for
people to listen to. And so what we’re going to do now is we’re going
to go from that point and look at where you’ve come in the last two
years. You’ve provided me with a little summary here of some of the
bullet points to help me. You know with the agenda here and not to
act as a spoiler but just to get people excited. We’re going to talk
about how you went. You’ve been able to taper Enbrel so let’s talk
about tapering Enbrel and what that experience has been like. You’ve
competed in yoga competitions. You’ve given a presentation in the UK
and also locally in your town of now where are you at again. You’re
in Portland Oregon aren’t you.

Katy Yes.

Clint And
then we’re going to talk about you had to have knee surgery because
you left one of your knees was just extraordinarily damaged and we’ll
talk about that. So we’ll talk about what the experience was like
having a knee replacement surgery and expanding foods on the program.
And also this procedure of Rohlfing And what that experience is like
and how that’s helped you. So where do we want to start here.

Clint Why
don’t we. You want to pick one and run with one of those.

Katy Well I
think the tapering off of Vicodin and the Enbrel cause that’s what
happened next. Okay.

Katy So I
started tapering off the Vicodin so in October I was officially off
the Vicodin in October 2017. My pain levels had dropped
consistently. So yeah.

Katy And then
I gave my first talk was also in October I shared my story for the
first time which was exciting. And then just today last yea was when
I started tapering off the Enbrel. So I was doing once an injection
50 milligrams a week. So one shot per week is what I’ve been doing
since I was 10 years old. Right. And then so I started spacing it
from once a week to every once every other week with my doctor’s
permission and all that. And then so I started doing that for three
months. And then the next three months it was every two weeks.

Katy And then
for the next three months then the next time was at least once every
three weeks. And then right now currently I’m at just once a month.

Clint Wow.

Katy And off
the Vicodin.

Clint Okay so
let the enbrel stuff is fascinating and let me tell you why it’s
extremely fascinating is because it’s so uncommon, it is just so
uncommon to taper off and get off these biologic drugs. I mean it’s
so uncommon that like doctors really don’t necessarily have a plan
for how to do this because it’s not something that happens enough to
develop a plan for. So I’m interested about it what you whether your
doctor gave you warnings about whether or not you might for example
develop antibodies against the enbrel by taking it so infrequently
that your body then experiences a shift and can become almost
antagonistic towards the drug. Were there any warnings about tapering
the Enbrel. What did the doctor say. And so on.

Katy He
didn’t really tell me any like warnings, like he just said that he
doesn’t prefer it and doesn’t like to bring people off. He did say it
because it can. Because once you get off of it it can come back. Then
you have the possibility of it not working again or so. Or it getting
worse or something like that. Yeah. He didn’t say too much he just
said that he really doesn’t like it. But he also noticed that he also
respects my opinion which I really appreciate and so yeah. He’s been
pretty with onboard you know. I mean he always says you’re still on
that special diet. I’m like yeah yeah.

Clint Yeah. I
wanted to ask him next time you go and see him how often does he see
people tapering off Enbrel and how common is it to be doing this
because I expect him to say that you’re his first. I really do. I
expect himand it’s quite funny because you know that’ll be a nice
moment. Now we know that we know that it’s not all like rainbows and
unicorns and stuff coming off these drugs and so on so at times have
you sensed the feeling of less support or less protection that the
drug gives you when you’ve been expanding your foods or maybe you
skip a couple of days of exercise. Do you feel more exposed?

Katy To be
honest. Not really. I haven’t really felt any like bad side effects
from tapering or you know I actually feel better and have more energy
like and it’s like you know I can’t. I mean I’ve been injured. I mean
I’ve been poking myself for 17 years you know and it’s just it’s such
a relief to just only take it once month it’s like it’s so nice. Yeah
I just felt so great. I feel good and I do a bunch of Bikram
basically every day. I’m doing a lot of home exercises as well so

Clint Yeah I think that what you just said cannot be understated enough or emphasized enough I should say doing something like Bikram yoga every day is the kind of thing that is normally necessary to take away an enormous medication or two to drop it by a quarter effectively as what you’ve done when you’ve been dependent on it for your entire life especially after getting off all those Vicodins which I’ll also question you about in a second.

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Clint So I
think we’ll talk about yoga in a second we’ll give that a whole own
section but I think to conclude the enbrel tapering sort of component
you can’t just decide one day I Okay I’m just gonna get off this this
big biologic drug and you know I’m eating well and so I’m just going
to eat well and get off my drug that just doesn’t work. You’ve got to
have everything in place you’ve got to have the exercise dialled into
a ten out of ten and your diet has to be sensational and probably
have been sensational for a long period of time just as yours was.
You were two years because it was two years into the diet that you
began approximately I believe to to start to taper the Enbrel maybe a
year and a half but you’ve put in you’re putting the long long long
months. You know.

Katy Yeah

Clint And you
also have to have the mindset that if pain does start to come back
that you’re ready and prepared to deal with that whether that be
switched back just to more baseline eating or whether it be go to
yoga or whatever exercise choice people have and do it like every day
and be absolutely really really determined to do that every day
because without the med you’ve got to have something in there to take
up that inflammation.

Katy Right.
Well there has been you know there’s been times when like I went on a
hike with my nephews. I know it’s a couple miles and then I when I
came back I was limping. And then like the next morning I was still
limping. But on those days I went to the earliest Bikram class
available and I would just lay down on my mat throughout the entire
series and I would do the floor series because it was hard to do the
standing. And just being in the hot room was great for me. And then
within a couple days I mean within the next day or so like I was up
on my feet again perfectly normal so yeah the Bikram is what
definitelyme keeps me going.

Clint I have a little bit of a pipe dream that may come into fruition in the next 12 months which is that I am thinking about having people come and stay near where my family and I are going to be living in Florida in just just a few weeks from when we’re recording this so from July 2019 it’ll be onwards we’re going to be living in Florida for a period of time and I have a thought about you know it’s where we live is a holiday location right. So we’re in sort of south Florida right near the beach and it’s a place that people come on vacation in the US especially during the summer months of July and August and so on and so I’ve had the idea that people can come stay at an Air BnB just near where where we live and come with me each day to Bikram get the get the feeling of of team that we can have by having a few people at a time, do Bikram every day get green juices afterwards spend the rest of day just chillin down the beach increase Vitamin D. Talking about plans with foods to improve eating and and I think that that as a kind of you know unique style of of health retreat where we’re all doing their own thing but we meet each day and we get things done and we improve and we share ideas and stuff. Maybe something I might be looking at. So and the point of saying all that is maybe to get a little feedback if anyone’s listening or watching that be interested in participating in that certainly shoot me an email.

Clint But the
other point of it is that part of the core foundation of that is that
it facilitates daily Bikram yoga. Okay so you know you sometimes have
to travel to get the best possible physical activity in your life.
I’ve recommended to some people who are really struggling and they
say look I’m doing the diet. I’ve taken some of these supplements to
help but this isn’t working. And I say what exercise do you do. It’s
difficult because of this that and the other. Like seriously. Pull
some dollars together. Go on a holiday where you can go to Bikram
Yoga everyday because if anyone ever is an example of what it can do
it’s you. And so let’s just move. Let’s let’s we’ll come back to the
Viking and perhaps if we have time because you got off that just by
doing all the same sort of things that helped you get off the Enbrel
and the. And and the Viking and same sort of thing. So let’s talk
about your yoga because you’ve taken it to a whole new level since we
last communicated. Talk abou rwhat you’ve done on a yoga front. You
competitions, the help you’ve received and all the friendships that
you’ve made at your studio and so on.

Katy So yeah
I’ve I basically go six to seven days a week. And then it’s in about
September 2017,I started training for the USA yoga competition. And
so that’s when I started learning how to do wall walks and started
the lunges and all that. All those exercises.

Katy And so I
competed in March. That was the first. The regional competition. And
of course that was extremely scary for me. But it was good. It was
good in the way that I like my my reasons for competing was because I
know that I have a lot of insecurities about my body about how I
look and so I knew that and I’ve always wanted to improve that but I
didn’t know how and so I’m I’m using this competition to work through
those insecurities because it forces me to you know you stand on a
stage for three minutes of silence in front of three judges with a
spotlight on you. And it’s very intimidating but it also it gives me
a chance to just show who I am and show myself and to show my
progress and to be with the friends. You know it’s a really special

Katy And I
remember that a few minutes before I got on, I was super shaky and
nervous and one of the other competitors came up to me and she gave
me a hug. Again we took a picture together and then I just got up on
stage and I was just so like so much more relaxed just because of
that you know.

Katy And so
yeah I have made many great friendships with yoga people and just
watching them go on stage is just so inspiring like I just was
staring at them like and are just like oh my gosh look.

Katy So I did
that and then…

Clint Well
before you move on. Did you feel that sense of accomplishment after
you did that and achieved what you had hoped to achieve with
overcoming that fear of self-image.

Katy Absolutely.
I mean I’m still working through it. You know I’m still struggling.
But but it’s everyday. It’s you know I’m working through it and every
time I go on stage it’s a little better. Like compared to this year,
this year’s competition was like night and day difference compared to
my first time.

Katy I was so
much more confident and so much more excited and just light and happy
and you know I also have gotten a lot of help from you know from like
Kim Taylor who is my coach and Joseph Insignia. You know and so
having all of their help it’s just been tremendous. And. Yeah.

Clint They say that we rise to the expectations of our peers. And so when youre surrounding yourself with yoga champions that you just mentioned and people who have really taken this sort of physical expression or exercise format to the highest level and they look towards you and they expect more of you. We really respond to that at dates like this is incredible powerful magnet that pulls our performance forward it doesn’t even feel like we’re working at it.

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Clint So. And
the conquering of the fear I’ve gotta say this has just been just so
impressive to watch. I was watching the video of view on stage the
first time and I’m like “This girl is special”. To go on
stage and to clearly have some challenges physically that the other
competitors haven’t got whether it be an extended limb here or just
you know whether it be the experience and the years of practicing

Clint But I
was so impressed. I mean you’ve impressed me so many different ways.
But when I saw that it was like an order of magnitude more and I
showed Melissa and she’s like wow she’s so brave. So you know it
takes a special person. And and I don’t know how I’d feel to go on
stage and and do some various postures and I’ve done over a thousand
classes because you know it’s intimidating and it’s intimidating. And
the interesting I can draw a parallel to wanting to conquer that kind
of fear or that kind of limiting belief we have in our life by how I

Clint I never
wanted to do that as a job as a profession. I didn’t even want to get
on stage. I did it because I was terrified of public speaking and
that’s how it began.I thought I’ve got this awful fear. How can I
conquer this fear of giving presentations in the corporate world
because I was young and having to give lots of presentations to
people much older and with much more experience and knowledge than
me. And so I chose that sort of diving in at the deep end and trying
stand up comedy and that’s how it began it had no it was not an
aspirational thing at all it was purely a I need to sort out my fear
here and I see that in what you’ve done there and it’s just makes me
feel really really you know just a lot of awe with what you’ve done.
And I also what I have observed as well if I may with watching you
evolve over the last few years and mature I want to say and build
confidence also is this friendship group that you’ve got at your yoga
studio. Is it fair to say that they pretty much have become your
closest team, your closest friends and basically building your social

Katy Absolutely.
Yeah. You know they been just I mean because they see me every day
basically. You know they see me they see me on the good days the bad
days the days I can’t walk or the days I limp. The days they see it
all you know and my and my everyday teachers you know I love each and
every one of them. They are a part of why I keep going.

Katy You know
it’s like there’s some days when I wake up and I’m like Do I really
want to go. Then I check the schedule and I say oh like so-and-so is
teaching I’ll go I’ll go. You don’t like it. There is every single
one of them. And yeah each of the other students they’ve become my
family basically you know like when I first started going I couldn’t
even get undressed or dress myself in that dressing room with the
other ladies.

Katy I was
just so self-conscious and I just you know I would go in the bathroom
I would change because I didn’t want people looking at me. And you
know. But over time just slowly but surely. Now I’m. It’s OK. Like I
dress and I undress and it’s normal, it’s a normal part of my life
now. And it’s just they’re just so much love and so much
understanding, compassion. Yeah I would not be where I am without

Clint Yes.
And whilst a lot of the audience might not be able to access a Bikram
yoga studio I think that the message is still a powerful one.

Clint If
people are trying to implement this in their life find yourself
people who you can connect with and who you can surround yourself
with frequently who share your common belief system and the same
goals or desires that you have or at least believe that you can
achieve them because the power of community and you know show me
someone’s friends and I’ll show you that person or birds of a feather
flock together however you want to wrap this up. The people you
surround yourself with influence your outcome more than anything
because they will keep you on track.

Clint They
will encourage you and remind you to keep eating the foods, are
encouraging and say it’s working for you and keep you on track. So I
love that. I love how you’ve shared that because it’s such a
powerful community that you’ve got around you and I want to thank all
of them because they’ve helped you get to where you are. So what a
great team.

Katy Yeah.
Yeah. And you know I’ve watched you know a lot when at the beginning
like there was things postures I couldn’t do at the time but I would
just keep watching them and just they inspired me and so you know and
they always said you know like I have like Aesop Sakurai says like
your limit less like you know like you know you can do anything you
put your mind to basically you know and just having that kind of
support and that kind of like you know a you can dream it, you can do
it kind of thing.

Katy You know
it is so uplifting and so like it keeps me going. You know it keeps
my hope up.

Clint Oh yes.
And then you went on a retreat as well and spent some time with
Joseph Insignia who was a guest on our podcast and one of the earlier
episodes. Another great episode to go and listen to if you’re looking
for some of the back catalogue to catch up on. Tell us about that
experience and I think you also have a little skill that you’ve
developed as wel spending some time with Joseph.

Katy Yeah.
Yeah. So I first met Joseph so I’ve been wanting to meet Joseph since
I started Bikram yoga. Like that’s one of my dreams is to meet
Joseph. And so in September 2018 I bought a plane ticket to
California to go and meet him in California. He was doing a two day
workshop and like I felt like this instant connection with him from
the second he walked in the door and and then so then later on I saw
the opportunity to he does yoga retreat in Costa Rica and I was like
Oh I have to, I have to do everything I can and go to that. And so I
did and here Oh it was just the most magical week like it was like
six day in the warm sun every day, Bikram every day with him like you
know there’s like there’s one day that he did the Bikram class with
us like you.

Katy He
actually did it with us and it was stirring and he reached out and he
was next to me and he put both arms out and like so we connected our
arms together as we lifted each other up you know. And he was just
such a cool guy. He was just such a special I mean there’s just
something so special about practicing spectrum with someone who has
been through what you’ve been through you know. Yeah.

Clint It’s
just as a quick reminder to folks not maybe familiar with him. He’s
had developed rheumatoid arthritis in his teenage years and has used
Bikram yoga as his primary method to stay off medications actually
get him off medications and stay off them for well over 10 years. If
I’m not not mistaken.

Clint So yeah
yeah you’re right it’s. Right. Yes.

Clint Yes. So
I mean he’s another example of someone who’s really embraced this
particular format of exercise to get maximum results.

Katy Yeah. Yeah. And like they they arranged my food for the whole week. They made sure there’s no oils, it was all vegan. They did a great job with that. And yeah I just had it. And the people the other yogis that came were I became friends with them and it was just really fun. Like he took me out on his little moped and we went out to the beach and we went to the shops and yeah it was a great week.

Clint Does he
do it every year. Is it something that you’d recommend that people
look up to go and attend themselves.

Katy Yeah
that’s right. I think he does it every year. He did it the year
before that and the year before that. So yeah and I met his wife and
his wife is so beautiful they’re just perfect for each other. And so
spending time with her was really nice.

Clint Yeah.
Yeah. A huge plug for that then if you know as I mentioned before
about coming to Florida and hanging with me for a couple of weeks and
go into yoga each day well he’s a world champion. You couldn’t do
much better than going to Costa Rica in the experience and going to
take his class every day. Another wonderful opportunity to really
improve your health. Almost guaranteed you’re going to walk out of
that six days with better health than what you did when you went
there. You can’t say that with many retreats or experiences all these
getaways but you can almost guarantee that couldn’t you that after
six days you get to have a better body leaving that place.

Katy Yeah.
And what I liked about it is it wasn’t just Bikram all day, it wasn’t
just yoga all day like we took trips out and we did like add zip
lining. Other people did surfing. Yeah.

Clint Yeah.
It was fun.

Clint It was
so it wasn’t just all about Hey we’ve got an objective. Let’s just
crank it out. It’s fun too which is important.

Katy Yeah.

Clint You’ve
given a couple of presentations. You mentioned one earlier you went
to the UK and gave a presentation in the Isle of Man. Was this the
first time travelling outside of the US?

Katy No I had
been to the Netherlands 2016 I think. But yeah that was. So it’s my
second time out.

Katy But yeah
I was kind of because I remember messaging Jackie and saying like oh
wouldn’t it be cool if I came over. And then it just sort of
happened. And then Andy graciously let me stay with him for a couple
weeks in Oxford. And then I took some Bikram classes with him and
that was amazing.

Katy He’s
super inspirational just I mean same thing like with Joseph. Like
practicing with Andy was just very special. And yeah. He took me out
to a bunch of places sightseeing and then we went to the Isle of Man
and met Jackie and her family and I met Don and Ida and her baby and.

Clint And if
they aren’t familiar what you’re basically doing is listing a whole
bunch of guests that we’ve had on the show in the past or people who
online is also part of our online support group. And these are people
who become like family. And yet I haven’t actually met in person any
of the people you’ve mentioned including yourself in person. But it
really does feel like a worldwide family of people who are following
a low fat plant based diet exercising a lot and supporting each other
with inflammatory arthritis. So must have been cool to meet them and
give you talk. So talk about that.

Katy Yeah. So it was me and Iida. We gave our talks and she went first. Then I went last. And yeah it went a lot better than my first talk. And I think part of it was just having them there. Like on the sidelines. It was helpful for me and I just shared from my heart and and it went really well. And I think a lot of people learnt a lot. Which is good.

Get the Paddison Program

Clint Is that
the one that’s s available online.

Katy Yes I
believe it’s on YouTube.

Clint Okay
great. Okay excellent. So if people go to my YouTube channel then
they’ll be able to find that just going Paddison Program Katy
presentation. I think something like that should bring that back in.

Clint It
should bring that up. Well that’s very exciting so two talks now
telling your story you’re becoming and two podcasts, you’ve becoming
a little bit of a spokesperson and an expert in this and as we as the
years pass I think more so and more so. We’ve talked about a lot of
good stuff. Let’s talk about the knee surgery that you had to have
now. You’ve had this inflammation in your bodies for your whole life.
And you mentioned I recall from the previous podcast that the
inflammation was never fully controlled with the Enbrel and so you’ve
always had some degree of inflammation going on hence the need for
the Vicodins. And so there’s always been some degree of ongoing
damage to your body. And so we spoke and I suggested I believe I
might have not been my idea but I certainly was in favour of at least
you going and getting x ray done on your knee when you continued to
complain about how sore your knee was even in spite of all the good
things you were doing. Well when I saw that X-ray of your knee I
didn’t hold out much hope of being able for you to avoid a knee
replacement and not because I was much of an expert in x rays of
knees but I think anyone who would look at that would say Oh my God
you are not going to be able to use that knee because it was

Katy Well
yeah yeah. My doctor said it was one of three here. He had never seen
a knee bone on bone that bad

Clint I think
it was shocking we might I might even get you to send me a picture of
it and we’ll put it in the show notes of the episode so when we put
the episode out people can go to our blog which is
paddisonprogram.com/blog and find your episode here and look at the
show notes the transcription and see the picture because goodness me.
And so then we talked about whether or not you should have the
replacement. We sent the image off to Dr. Clapper and Dr. Clapper
came back and said most definitely that is a joint that has to have a
knee replacement regardless of your age. And so you went ahead and
did it. Can you give us what it’s like having a knee replacement.

Katy Yeah. So
it was actually my first regional competition was a week before my
knee surgery. So I was in a ton of pain when I went to the
competition and then so yeah. So I had the knee surgery in March and
you know the first few days after the surgery I was on so much drugs
like I don’t remember half of I don’t remember half of what happened
the first couple days just because of all the drugs and they had me
on heavy opiates.

Katy Not
Vicodine but Oxycodine for the pain and it was one of the worst the
most painful experiences I’ve experienced in a long time. And it was
hard because I had to keep moving it. I had to keep exercising it
even though it was in pain. Even though I really didn’t want to but
it was very important that I had to do these exercises that the
therapist gave me for the knee to to not get stuck and so the
recovery was really difficult. And I actually lost a lot of weight
because the opiates were making me super nauseous. So I would puke
all the time. And so yeah there, it was just hard.

Katy But two
weeks two weeks after the surgery I went back to Bikram yoga. They
told me I could go back and I used a chair. I had to use a chair. I
couldn’t stand for more than like five seconds at a time. I had to
take multiple breaks so it’s like starting over is basically like
starting from scratch because it changed everything. I mean having a
new knee just like it changed the way I walked it changed everything.

Katy And so I
just had to kind of reteach myself how to do everything. But it was
so much better. Like I mean I’m very thankful that I had it. And it’s
doing a lot better now. I mean the scar is basically gone. It’s

Clint For
those of us including myself who at some point in the future may have
to have one done. I’m quite interested in just your sort of fors and
against what would be the fors. Now with your hindsight being able to
look back and then the against.

Katy I think
the biggest thing is I wish I knew how much work is actually going to
be. I figured once the surgery was after the surgery I thought that
my knee would be able to go all the way bent and all the way straight
like right away. That was definitely not the case.

Katy I had to
work extremely hard every single day to get by a knee straight and to
get it. I mean it’s still not where I want it to be today but it’s
getting there slowly but surely you know it’s expanding more and it’s
definitely straighter than it was. My goodness I mean before surgery
it was completely off the ground, my knee it could not straighten at
all but now it can go completely straight.

Katy Right.
So there’s the warning is that don’t expect a miracle. You’ll have to
put in an enormous amount of effort to get the result that you are
hoping for. If you’re starting with a knee that maybe like yours was
was very very bad and maybe all the connective tissue around it had
not straightened or had not gone into complete flexion for many many
years because of the limitations of the joint. So it’s like just
starting another chapter not really the end of the problem it’s just
a new chapter when you get the new knee and there’s still a lot of
work to do.

Katy Yeah.
And it’s definitely new muscles like you know before surgery like my
left leg basically took a lot of the weight on my other leg took a
lot of the weight and so learning how to build up the muscles in my
new leg because now that my knee is able to work and function better
and it can straiten better and you know and so really I found a lot
of new muscles and working really hard at strengthening all that.

Clint I
remember the images that you sent through because you were sharing
some very graphic images of that knee just days after it might have
been day three or four when you gain some sort of consciousness.

Clint And I
mean it looked like some kind of sort of something out of the Alien
film or something. I mean it was really bruised it was so swollen and
scarring and I mean it was really really unpleasant to look at.

Katy The
doctors put like this Torniquet thing you know for the surgery they
had to put a tourniquet around my leg to stop the bleeding. And so
they like tied it like super tight. So then when they released it
everything just exploded like my whole leg was just like it was like
a huge and it was soft like it was like you could push down on it and
say Oh just gross and it freaked me out like I was like What. I’m
like Is this going to like blow up how big like you know.

Katy And yeah
it went down but yeah it was a little scary. I did have some very
emotional moments.

Clint Mm hmm.
Oh boy. It was not a poster that you would use to advertise knee
surgery. It looked horrible but I guess you know amazing what a
recovery the body can make. It’s amazing that you’ve now got it to
where it is now because it looks so bad and what a testimonial to the
body being able to to heal itself is incredible. As we come towards
the end here I just want to now touch upon some of the other
exercises that you’re doing and whether or not you think that be
helpful for other people if they’re unable to do Bikram yoga or if
they just want some things to do in parallel. Can you talk about yin
yoga hot pillates and your experience with those and also want then
your ideas around Rohlfing And whether or not you feel that that’s
been helpful.

Katy Where do
you want me to start?

Clint Talk
about yin yoga and hot pillates and tell me what if you feel that
they’re suitable for people who are inflamed.

Katy Oh yeah.
So for the first few months I was Bikram only you know for the first
like half of the year and then slowly I started to get into yin yoga.
And that has really for those few who don’t exactly know it’s about
opening your connective tissue and stretching your connect. So it’s
very slow. It’s it’s in a heated room but not hot hot but just

Katy And
that’s really helped my flexibility and expanding I don’t know how to
say it, expanding my mind muscles like range. Yeah yeah. And like my
hamstrings my hamstrings used to be super super tight. But with the
yin yoga it’s really helped stretch those hamstrings out.

Katy And I do
yin yoga about two times a week roughly and yeah. It’s just super
relaxing and I think it’s a great comfort. A lot of times I do Bikram
and then I take the yin class right afterwards and I find the
combination. It’s just perfect. You do the Bikram and then you can
just relax and you know and it’s always nice music Like keeps calming
music and like I have my favourite yin teachers and yeah I definitely
think that’s a great compliment to yoga and to Bikram and people with
arthritis. I mean it’s definitely helped me.

Clint It’s a
world apart from Bikram I mean I would never enjoy and still never
enjoy Bikram but yin just feels just like this pure bliss because you
just you know to put it simply you basically get into a position on
the floor and you just stay there for five minutes while you let a
muscle stretch and then you move on to another position. I mean it’s
very light. I wouldn’t say that it’s a pain relieving class.

Clint If
we’re talking about trying to get out of a high state of inflammation
it’s not the class but if you’ve got another form of exercise that
plays that role then yin can be wonderful in terms of doing what you
said and also just giving us this escape from the day to day grind of
life very sort of soothing class that can certainly I’m sure act as a
form of meditation or at least stress reduction. Tell us about

Katy Yeah. So
I don’t do too much currently just because I have so much going on.
Yeah. The pillates is it’s really it’s more strengthening. It’s more
of a strengthening class. So like your upper body, your core or your
arms. So I’d say it’s more high intensity it’s usually it’s put up to
like work out music.

Katy You have
a lot of like and so we do a lot of planks. There’s a lot of planks
and glute bridges and squats and it’s really fun. It’s like an hour
long. But I didn’t start doing that until after my knee surgery
really was when I really started getting to it. And it really helped.

Katy It
really helped strengthen my quads and my new knee. It really helped
strengthen those. And yeah it’s just that I find it just fun. It’s a
fun class. And it does help but I think it’s more on the advanced
side. Like for for us you know it’s more and I wouldn’t recommend it
for someone you know who has a ton of inflammation and stuff.

Clint Yeah.
Yep. Something we’ve never talked about on this podcast ever. Is this
therapy called Rohlfing. Can you tell us in just a couple of minutes
what your experience has been like with it and what it is.

Katy Yeah. So
I started Rohlfing in November 2013. And basically it’s like a
massage but it’s like ten times more intense. And basically it works
on creating more space in your body to move more freely. And so my
main goal that me and my Rohlferr Jake put together is that he just
wants me to be able to move more freely and without pain. And so. So
he works. So it starts off with a series of 10 sessions and then so
he works on different areas of your body. For each one. And then
after that it just kind of where you feel you need where you need
work on.

Katy And so
he does a lot of work on my feet. My ankles have definitely improved
that strange motion going back and forth and up and down and I just
feel it. It feels like there’s more space in my body and especially
in my hips and in my knees. And one of the things that I really
realize is that he and he talks about is how like when you have
issues with your knees it’s not just your knees, it’s your hips and
your feet and your knees are kind of like the middle you know they’re
kind of in the middle stuck here and so they get a lot of the brunt.
They get the brunt of the stuff. So if you can work but if so if your
feet and your hips are out of line it most likely means that your
knees aren’t gonna be painful.

Clint Yeah I
just think recent episode with Carl reader we talked about this exact
concept which is the knees just like a carriage on a railway track
that can just move back and forth you know up and down kind of motion
and it’s susceptible to what’s going on above and below it exactly
like you’ve described so you know from an observation viewpoint when
you’ve provided updates in the support group and you’ve said hey I
have done another Rohlfing session. You know they’ve always been
positive you’ve always had good experiences from this and to the
point where as I mentioned to you I explored it for myself and found
someone who does this procedure in Sydney there’s a couple on the
northern beaches where we we are at the moment and yes I intend at
some point to to have a couple of sessions myself. So it’s spelt R O
L F I N G so it’s like golfing but with R. So if anyone’s interested
I actually recommend it based entirely on your updates Katy because
you know you wouldn’t be wasting your money on a procedure unless you
found it beneficial so I’d love for people to go and try it and to
send through some feedback via email.

Clint I just
heard I’ve just heard the car pull up which is a signal to me that
things are about to get very loud here in the house as the whole
family has just come home. We wanted to talk about your food
expansion before we wrap up and we can go ahead and do that. But
before it gets a little this little distraction here behind me people
should definitely follow you on Instagram, your posts of your back
bends, your foods,your yoga classes that you take are you really do
captures snapshots of your day to day life living with the aim to you
know have the healthiest possible body really well and it’s a
fascinating you know Instagram account. So what is it. So everyone
can go follow you.

Katy It’s
Hoogen.3So it’s it’s the first like six letters of my last name and
then dot and then three.

Clint And I
say might want to spell it out.

Katy So

Clint Okay
great. Yes I highly recommend go follow Katie on Instagram. It’s a
you really don’t hide anything it’s all there for everyone to see. So
we’ve covered a lot. We will chat briefly about your foods but you
know we’ve learned a lot today from you. How you got off Enbrel how
you spread the distance on your injections out from weekly through an
hour out to four weekly. You got off the Vicodine using you know the
foods that we all know and love and your beloved Bikram yoga and
you’ve attended yoga competitions, you’ve given presentations locally
in your town and also in the UK. You’ve undergone knee surgery and
recovered from that and it’s been quite a ride.

Katy And an
eye surgery, eye surgery was in April.

Clint And an
eye surgery as well. So you’ve been through a ton and you’re still
smiling and you’re still inspiring many. So can you tell us just
about the your foods. Before we wrap up how are you still on like
basic baseline foods are you now able to eat some other things.

Katy So you
know I’ve started expanding a little bit. So basically I mean right
now I’ve started to introduce a little bit of nuts every day. I’m
eating black beans. And I make a really good. My favourite meal right
now is I make a black bean soup and then I make basmati rice and then
I mix it together. And I put salsa on it. I cut tomatoes now. I was
scared to try tomatoes because I heard a lot of people have bad
reactions. But no I (inaudible) tomato so I mix it with my salsa. And
it’s just it’s really it’s my favourite meal. And then for dessert
like I can have dates now so I make like a chocolate cupcake with
dates and I can either oats and apples so I make like this Au Pair
saying that Jackie actually made for me and then I made it. And yeah
I’m really happy with my diet. I love the food that I eat and it
keeps me energized.

Clint Yeah
that’s great. And so the greater message here is that whilst in the
past you had to say on a really strict simple set of foods to keep
the pain low. Now you’re able to eat a much more diverse diet albeit
still restricted.

Clint But it
now doesn’t feel like you’re really missing out on some of the real
staples like the oats a key. The rice is key. You know being able to
eat oats rice and then being able to eat some root vegetables and
stuff you really have the foundations in place with the leafy greens
and fruits. I mean we really have a healthy diet there even though
it’s simple and now getting some nuts in. I mean you’re starting to
complete all of the pieces of like a ideal plant based diet food
pyramid. So it sounded good. It sounded really good.

Katy Yeah I
still eat the green smoothies every day and I still juice. I try to
juice every single day. And yeah the green smoothie is something
which for me huge pain reliever. Huge. Yeah.

Clint And
what’s your favourite green smoothie combo for pain relief.

Katy The one
I always go to is just baby spinach bananas and some ice and water
sometimes I’ll add oats to it raw oats.

Clint Mm hmm.
So you’ll just go you just bananas and bananas and spinach with some
ice here. Yeah. Nice and simple, nice and simple.

Clint Well
this has been awesome. Did you want to do your little demonstration
that you asked about?

Katy Do we
have time.

Clint Yeah we
have time of course we can’t miss out on this. So you’ve got to watch
on YouTube to be able to to see this. You won’t be able to get the
full benefit if you’re listening to the podcast but we’re now about
to see Katydemonstrate. We’ll talk us through this katy before you do

Katy OK. This
is I’m not sure how to price. I still don’t know how to pronounce it
really but it’s called the Urabanta I believe and it basically helps
massage your internal organs. So it’s actually very good. It’s very
good for you and I do this. Most mornings I do it before breakfast
and I just do it a couple times. So finding the light.

Clint So I
walk through the people who were just listening to this. So we’ve got
a set of abs here. Katy is showing us her abs and now she’s sucking
them in.

Katy OK so I
breathe in very quickly three times and then the third time I’m going
to breathe and then I’m gonna suck this all in. So it’s kind of hard
to talk

Clint Wow.
That is serious ab strength to pull in the stomach like that. I mean
it makes it look like you’ve got a disappearing stomach. Like where
would any food go. That was quite incredible

Katy Eventually
they’ll just be that the stripped of my abs and everything else will
be sucked in around it. If you want to Joseph Insignia. I think it’s
on YouTube but he does it really well. He does a lot better than me

Clint Mm hmm.
Yeah I think I saw Bikram’s daughter do it and then roll from one
side to the other roll her stomach from one side. Is that the same

Katy Yeah

Clint Crazy
crazy amount of skill and dedication there. All right Katy well
thanks for sharing your update today. It’s been a pleasure to see yor
happy face agai,n you always make me smile and feel good about life
when I chat to you so for folks who have sat and enjoyed listening
and watching you I’m sure they really appreciate your level of
determination and commitment to your health and to getting well and
to inspiring others so thank you. And I look forward to staying in
touch online.

Clint All
right. Thank you.

Katy I love
you too.

Clint Bye for

Katy Bye.


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